Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

turtlebmw

Well-Known Member
Hi everyone,
I'm looking for advice on how to address such an issue.

A close friend of mine has recently collected her brand new car. Its quite a high end model, and one of the more premium brands. (May or May NOT be BMW). She chose black, and during the delivery, the paintwork had a brilliant wet shine to it, in the not so bright-not so dim delivery center.

When she got home, and saw the car under direct sunlight, she was horrified at the number of swirl marks on her car. They were all over! She immediately called her sales executive, and he took the car back to the workshop and sent it for a second polish.

The very next day she went down to pick up her car, and although there were slightly less swirl marks, they were still rather distinctive, especially when you look at them from an angle. She complained to her sales exec again, and he brought the service manager down to inspect the car. With my advice, she got them to power jet the car, and park it in direct sunlight, for inspection by the management. This of course made the swirl marks a lot more obvious. Besides that, she mentioned that the paint looked a little faded.

The dealer now proposes to send the car in for a THREE day car grooming, whereby instead of a 6 step polishing process, they will just start for step 4, as they claim they won't have to polish to deep into the clear coat of the paint, to remove the swirl marks.

This friend of mine is really upset, as she feels it is completely unacceptable for a BRAND new black car to be delivered with the paint in such a bad condition. The manager told her that it is impossible for anyone to receive a brand new car with absolutely ZERO scratches. That she agrees, but her car didn't just have A FEW scratches, the entire car is covered with swirl marks. There was another black car of the similar model at the delivery center, and she got them to drive it out under the open sun to compare. The other car only had a few minor scratches, and absolutely no swirl marks.

Please advice on what she should do. Her car is only 3 days old, and has already went in for THREE polishes. I told her that this is unacceptable for a new car to undergo such harsh treatment. Usually a brand new car would just have ONE pre delivery polish, and subsequently another every 6 months or so. I can only imagine how thin her clear coat would be after she drives the car for two years. Especially since now they propose sending the car for a THREE DAY POLISH.It is obvious that the workers who polished the car prior to delivery, had scratched the car.

What would you guys do? Is there anything she can request for, or claim?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance!
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

considering the car is brand new and only 3 days old I would definitely bang table for a new replacement. Alternative could be for them to come up with some really attractive package (warranty or free service for # of years) to compensate for this.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

hi,
It will be helpful if we know which make is the car ? PI or agent ? then probably will help a lot on our suggestion.

:)
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

sorry to tell u this buy 90% of brand new car has swirls... this is inevitable due to shipping and transport...

when u collect ur car its swirls free because showroom uses fillers to fill these swirls to it look good for a little bit of time... once fillers are gone... swirls can be seen...

what u need to do is not bang table... because it is a very common situation... in fact most people dont realise that fillers can last for months...

some people can have swirl free for 1st 3 months then suddenly swirls come once fillers are gone.... this is very common for dealers all over the world..not only singapore..

how to rectify ? you need paint restoration work or commonly known as polishing... i recommend you to go to forum sponsor like juzz brilliant or R2D for paint restoration... and get it of those swirls once and for all... top it up with some sealant or wax...

do not go to some kuching kurap polishing or polishing that does not do proper and real paint restorarion aka removing swirls... because again...90% of groomers out there uses fillers again...

how to tell diff between fillers and proper polished surface... use alchohol to wash the car... fillers will go away if it touches alchohol...

then again even after so much work.. proper maintenance of car is needed to keep the car swirl free...no petrol station wash and proper washing technique is important... if not every 1-2 years u also will have all these minor hairline scratches and swirls coming up again..... and repeat the process all over again...

remember... brand new car paint is 99% never perfect... it seems perfect... but never... just imagine how much dirt and dust stick to it during transporting.. and if u see the cars at the port... they are super dusty and dirty....
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

Yes, I fully agreed with Terry. I saw my car with the dust on from the port. look like gray while my car is in fact alpine white....but after the polish, look perfect for a couple of months only.

:)
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

Slater;426200 said:
considering the car is brand new and only 3 days old I would definitely bang table for a new replacement. Alternative could be for them to come up with some really attractive package (warranty or free service for # of years) to compensate for this.

Thats quite a good idea, i will let my friend know!

stevenwu;426202 said:
hi,
It will be helpful if we know which make is the car ? PI or agent ? then probably will help a lot on our suggestion.

:)

The car was not purchased from a PI. Authorized Agent. Better not to mention the make of the car. But its engine displacement is above 3,000CC.

Terry;426206 said:
sorry to tell u this buy 90% of brand new car has swirls... this is inevitable due to shipping and transport...

when u collect ur car its swirls free because showroom uses fillers to fill these swirls to it look good for a little bit of time... once fillers are gone... swirls can be seen...

what u need to do is not bang table... because it is a very common situation... in fact most people dont realise that fillers can last for months...

some people can have swirl free for 1st 3 months then suddenly swirls come once fillers are gone.... this is very common for dealers all over the world..not only singapore..

how to rectify ? you need paint restoration work or commonly known as polishing... i recommend you to go to forum sponsor like juzz brilliant or R2D for paint restoration... and get it of those swirls once and for all... top it up with some sealant or wax...

do not go to some kuching kurap polishing or polishing that does not do proper and real paint restorarion aka removing swirls... because again...90% of groomers out there uses fillers again...

how to tell diff between fillers and proper polished surface... use alchohol to wash the car... fillers will go away if it touches alchohol...

then again even after so much work.. proper maintenance of car is needed to keep the car swirl free...no petrol station wash and proper washing technique is important... if not every 1-2 years u also will have all these minor hairline scratches and swirls coming up again..... and repeat the process all over again...

remember... brand new car paint is 99% never perfect... it seems perfect... but never... just imagine how much dirt and dust stick to it during transporting.. and if u see the cars at the port... they are super dusty and dirty....

stevenwu;426213 said:
Yes, I fully agreed with Terry. I saw my car with the dust on from the port. look like gray while my car is in fact alpine white....but after the polish, look perfect for a couple of months only.

:)

Thanks Terry!
Yes she knows that you can never get a PERFECT brand new car. But in her case, the swirl marks are quite severe. Note that she has never driven the car in the rain. Infact after delivery, she drove home immediately, and that was when she noticed the swirls. The sales exec came to her house to take the car back for a second polish. After second polish, she still could see many swirls, so she got the manager to drive out a BRAND new, same model, same make car, to compare, and that car had like 10% the scratches that she had. THAT IS ACCEPTABLE. As the scratches were all just gentle lines and not confined to a particular part of the car. Her car is COVERED in swirls.

This should NOT be the case for a BRAND new car.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

Hi,
If it is a Porky or Ferrari or Masa, which cost so much, then should ask for discount, re-grooming and extra years of warranty since you can said that you lost confident in the car leow....if basic paintwork can be so bad, then how about others internal stuff.

If they disagreed, then call TCS down for interview and filming....heeee..

me bad.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

The car was not purchased from a PI. Authorized Agent. Better not to mention the make of the car. But its engine displacement is above 3,000CC.

3.2L continental car is it? If so, then it's probably because the dealer really very heck care about the condition of their cars. There have been cases where brand new cars from them suffer from watermarks etc due to prolonged exposure to harsh weather. And probably made worst by the cheap labour they use to polish their cars for pre-delivery.

Anyway, since the agent has noted the problem and made themselves liable for the fault, your friend is in not too bad a position. Just express her displeasure at their failed attempts to 'polish' out the swirl marks and insist to the sales guy that she be allowed to take it out to an established groomer, with any charges billed to the agent. If they can't remove the swirl marks in 3 sessions, chances are they never will. Will take some negotiations, but better than nothing.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

All my cars got swirls while brand new. for my recent car, i pointed out scratches to my SE on delivery. So later I took it up with Customer svc after i followed up with her. they offered me complimentary repolish by their inhouse ppl. I was reluctant, but gave it a shot cos the customer svc guy was really quite nice and apologetic about it. In the end, car come back still got marks. Possibly worse. I gave up. My time sending the car in and out is worth more than the couple of hundred dollars at a restorer of my choice. So I just left it.

I suggest your friend send it to a restorer of her choice and ask the dealer to reimburse. They will prob try to get you to use their in house groomer instead. Tell them, if their groomer make it worse or don't fix it, they refund her money and take the car back - then she will agree. See what they say?
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

actually... the agent will use back their in house groomer... which did the crappy job in the 1st place...

i would say save the trouble and spend a little bit on proper groomr outside...
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

Terry;426254 said:
actually... the agent will use back their in house groomer... which did the crappy job in the 1st place...

i would say save the trouble and spend a little bit on proper groomr outside...

not necessarily, cos i think the polishing for delivery is done by those uncles who wash ur car when u service. maybe i'm wrong... but some dealers got those linked up groomers who handle polishing post car delivery. So not the same crappy polisher? But can turn out to be just as lousy.

but i agree with u, just spend a bit more on a groomer u KNOW u can trust.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

motorknut;426245 said:
All my cars got swirls while brand new. for my recent car, i pointed out scratches to my SE on delivery. So later I took it up with Customer svc after i followed up with her. they offered me complimentary repolish by their inhouse ppl. I was reluctant, but gave it a shot cos the customer svc guy was really quite nice and apologetic about it. In the end, car come back still got marks. Possibly worse. I gave up. My time sending the car in and out is worth more than the couple of hundred dollars at a restorer of my choice. So I just left it.

I suggest your friend send it to a restorer of her choice and ask the dealer to reimburse. They will prob try to get you to use their in house groomer instead. Tell them, if their groomer make it worse or don't fix it, they refund her money and take the car back - then she will agree. See what they say?

BEST ANSWER OF THE NIGHT!

So i guess what she should do:
1) Ask for free servicing+polishing for # of years.
2) Allow them to take it back to their IN HOUSE polisher.
- If paint is just as bad...

= Full refund of car?

BTW: Which is the best polisher out there now?

Thanks so much everyone!
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

i know PML has their in house groomer... which do quite a good job... then again... for this kind of complain i think they will use crappier one...
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

Terry;426254 said:
actually... the agent will use back their in house groomer... which did the crappy job in the 1st place...

i would say save the trouble and spend a little bit on proper groomr outside...

Thanks Terry! Any particular groomer you can recommend?

motorknut;426257 said:
not necessarily, cos i think the polishing for delivery is done by those uncles who wash ur car when u service. maybe i'm wrong... but some dealers got those linked up groomers who handle polishing post car delivery. So not the same crappy polisher? But can turn out to be just as lousy.

but i agree with u, just spend a bit more on a groomer u KNOW u can trust.

Actually no, they apparently outsource a company to do the polishing. Although the polishing is done within the dealership's compounds.


n@u9ht;426234 said:
The car was not purchased from a PI. Authorized Agent. Better not to mention the make of the car. But its engine displacement is above 3,000CC.

3.2L continental car is it? If so, then it's probably because the dealer really very heck care about the condition of their cars. There have been cases where brand new cars from them suffer from watermarks etc due to prolonged exposure to harsh weather. And probably made worst by the cheap labour they use to polish their cars for pre-delivery.

Anyway, since the agent has noted the problem and made themselves liable for the fault, your friend is in not too bad a position. Just express her displeasure at their failed attempts to 'polish' out the swirl marks and insist to the sales guy that she be allowed to take it out to an established groomer, with any charges billed to the agent. If they can't remove the swirl marks in 3 sessions, chances are they never will. Will take some negotiations, but better than nothing.

Ironically i thought the more you spend on your car, the better the service!

Thanks for all the advice everyone! You've all been very helpful!
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

turtlebmw;426260 said:
BEST ANSWER OF THE NIGHT!

So i guess what she should do:
1) Ask for free servicing+polishing for # of years.
2) Allow them to take it back to their IN HOUSE polisher.
- If paint is just as bad...

= Full refund of car?

BTW: Which is the best polisher out there now?

Thanks so much everyone!

ok, when i said to state full refund of car as a clause? I kinda meant so you get more leverage to get reimbursed for groomer of your choice lah. cos let's face it... which dealer will risk taking car back over groomer right?

R2D look v dedicated from what i've read. Juzz Brilliant seem good too. But best is to go down and see for yourself how they work.

Good luck to your friend!

Terry;426261 said:
i know PML has their in house groomer... which do quite a good job... then again... for this kind of complain i think they will use crappier one...
not such a good job nowadays...
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

motorknut;426272 said:
ok, when i said to state full refund of car as a clause? I kinda meant so you get more leverage to get reimbursed for groomer of your choice lah. cos let's face it... which dealer will risk taking car back over groomer right?

R2D look v dedicated from what i've read. Juzz Brilliant seem good too. But best is to go down and see for yourself how they work.

Good luck to your friend!


not such a good job nowadays...

HAHAH! but that sounds like a great idea!
I shall ask her to propose that first: Use their recommended THREE day polish, if swirls still present, FULL refund.

if they dont accept that offer

then i shall send to my own reputable groomer!?

I heard of a very expensive groomer along jln peminpin. Any ideas what the company is called. They charge close to 800 per polish.
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

i used to go to spa for cars.... best hands down... but due to some prob they close down...

alternative will be juzz brilliant or R2D....

dont go the main stream places... i wouldnt mention names.... but dont go to places where they dont know their stuff... when they only promote product....

polishing is skill... not product...

btw there is one guy in other forum by the name of GEN2... if anyone knows about him.. he is freelance doing real and proper paint restoration... he does only 1 car per day and his booking is like 2-3 months in advance
 
Re: Help! Swirl Marks on BRAND NEW car.

stevenwu;426213 said:
Yes, I fully agreed with Terry. I saw my car with the dust on from the port. look like gray while my car is in fact alpine white....but after the polish, look perfect for a couple of months only.

:)
not quite agree...
i got bad experience in my preview e60 delivery after the PDI polished it before delivery.... took it back the body work department repolished it and the swirl is reduced but again my car wasn't black.

when i took my new delivery in january this year, i make a stern request that PDI do not polish the car rather than just clean them. (thks to fellow forumer reminded me this which i almost forgot). Took the car and immediately bring it to groomer house. Not a single swirl marks and under petrol station flood ligt what i saw was mirror finish paint work.

there is a debate among car owners on either to let PDI polish or not before delivery as it might not expose paint work issues at delivery.

so the advise is do not let PDI center polish your new ride other than just light cleaning of the delivery wax coating.

as for OP's question.. checking if the clear coat is damage or not helps.. just need to get the dealer to appoint a top class polisher to remove the swirl. An experienced polisher can polish without inducing swirl marks.
 

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