JuzzforCars
Well-Known Member
Re: PML BS again?
Sir, don't tell me all these problems are on your car now?
:yikess:
pingman said:
Sir, don't tell me all these problems are on your car now?
:yikess:
PML BS again?
- Thread starter Grandpa
- Start date
Re: PML BS again?
Thank you all for the great response within just one day!
I guess the summary to the answers is "do it at your own risk" and it really depends on which CSA I bump into and what he feels like on the day?! It's rediculious most of the BMW lovers here have to deal with this kind of cr@p with PML, and looks like some of your experience are worse than my nightmares with them.
Just wondering... has anyone consulted CASE in regards to this (loosing the warranty if not serviced at PML)? In some countries, it is illegal for the manufacturer / dealer even to force the customer to use certain Brand of oil or filters.
Thank you all for the great response within just one day!
I guess the summary to the answers is "do it at your own risk" and it really depends on which CSA I bump into and what he feels like on the day?! It's rediculious most of the BMW lovers here have to deal with this kind of cr@p with PML, and looks like some of your experience are worse than my nightmares with them.
Just wondering... has anyone consulted CASE in regards to this (loosing the warranty if not serviced at PML)? In some countries, it is illegal for the manufacturer / dealer even to force the customer to use certain Brand of oil or filters.
Re: PML BS again?
I am suprised that several senior members did not contribute even though many of these guys are members of the legal fratenity .
There are 2 contracts here
1) PML Sales contract
2) Sales of Goods Act Cap
(certain terms are implied by law , and PML cannot contract out of it)
http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/non_vers...e.pl?&actno=Reved-393&date=latest&method=part
Under (1) , you will need to review the terms and conditions of the contract carefully.For (2) look at Implied terms about quality or fitness.
I've used 3rd party servicing for a long time . I feel adquately protected by (2) .
Grandpa said:
I am suprised that several senior members did not contribute even though many of these guys are members of the legal fratenity .
There are 2 contracts here
1) PML Sales contract
2) Sales of Goods Act Cap
(certain terms are implied by law , and PML cannot contract out of it)
http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/non_vers...e.pl?&actno=Reved-393&date=latest&method=part
Under (1) , you will need to review the terms and conditions of the contract carefully.For (2) look at Implied terms about quality or fitness.
I've used 3rd party servicing for a long time . I feel adquately protected by (2) .
Re: PML BS again?
i didn't list 10 damaged items but 10 problems i had which i wanted them to fix under warranty. they ranged from small things like a loose glove compartment catch, window seals, rattles/squeaks in 3 locations, to more hardcore stuff like DTC and (!) warning lights, notchy gearbox, sticky steering....
can't help you with items 1,2,4 and 5.
but i brought our previous 318, told the CSA about squeaky brakes and he said my brake rotors were scored and he changed them under warranty. i was pretty amazed really, as i had always thought that rotors were a wear & tear item.
pingman said:
i didn't list 10 damaged items but 10 problems i had which i wanted them to fix under warranty. they ranged from small things like a loose glove compartment catch, window seals, rattles/squeaks in 3 locations, to more hardcore stuff like DTC and (!) warning lights, notchy gearbox, sticky steering....
can't help you with items 1,2,4 and 5.
but i brought our previous 318, told the CSA about squeaky brakes and he said my brake rotors were scored and he changed them under warranty. i was pretty amazed really, as i had always thought that rotors were a wear & tear item.
Re: PML BS again?
the warranty obligation given to you by PML is a separate consideration to any rights that you may have under the SOG.. and it is certainly more extensive.
i have no doubt there is enough black and white in the warranty T&C's that will enable PML to void the warranty if you dont service the car with them..
given that if things go wrong with BMW's, the cost of repairs dont tend t obe cheap... i think the better course of action for you would be to bite the bullet and do the minimum service requirements at PML.
as some suggested, you can bring your own oil etc to cut down their costs.
marclees said:
the warranty obligation given to you by PML is a separate consideration to any rights that you may have under the SOG.. and it is certainly more extensive.
i have no doubt there is enough black and white in the warranty T&C's that will enable PML to void the warranty if you dont service the car with them..
given that if things go wrong with BMW's, the cost of repairs dont tend t obe cheap... i think the better course of action for you would be to bite the bullet and do the minimum service requirements at PML.
as some suggested, you can bring your own oil etc to cut down their costs.
Re: PML BS again?
I beg to differ . The PML contract extensive T&Cs are still invariably subjected to the 'reasonableness' test of the Unfair Contract Terms Act (Cap 396). In my view , any T&Cs that attempts to void the warranty because servicing is not done at PML is likely to be struck down by the Courts as unreasonable.. Where the nexus between the two is more remote , the probability becomes even higher.
Give an example, I service my car at Tan Ah Kow workshop ; but at the end of 9 months, the boot cannot close . If PML attempts to void my warranty , I would be more than happy to pursue the matter in court. I am 100% sure I will win.
I used to own a parallel imported 32x coupe. I never serviced at PML . When there was a warranty issue , PML had to resolve it. Sure , they gave me quite a fair amount of BS and administrative delays ; all I did was keep yelling at BMW Asia , and AG . Needless to say, I won.
mistraele said:
I beg to differ . The PML contract extensive T&Cs are still invariably subjected to the 'reasonableness' test of the Unfair Contract Terms Act (Cap 396). In my view , any T&Cs that attempts to void the warranty because servicing is not done at PML is likely to be struck down by the Courts as unreasonable.. Where the nexus between the two is more remote , the probability becomes even higher.
Give an example, I service my car at Tan Ah Kow workshop ; but at the end of 9 months, the boot cannot close . If PML attempts to void my warranty , I would be more than happy to pursue the matter in court. I am 100% sure I will win.
I used to own a parallel imported 32x coupe. I never serviced at PML . When there was a warranty issue , PML had to resolve it. Sure , they gave me quite a fair amount of BS and administrative delays ; all I did was keep yelling at BMW Asia , and AG . Needless to say, I won.
Re: PML BS again?
Thank you all again for all the inputs.
Actually it's really not about cutting down the cost... going with 3rd party isn't that much cheaper anyway. The issue here is PML's After Sales service is extremely unprofessional and full of non senses, and not to mention about the simple things they cannot fix and break other things! It's depressing to spend even a dollar with them.... and now they are effectively threathening that I should spend S$300+ with them or the warranty will be voided?
Thank you all again for all the inputs.
mistraele said:
Actually it's really not about cutting down the cost... going with 3rd party isn't that much cheaper anyway. The issue here is PML's After Sales service is extremely unprofessional and full of non senses, and not to mention about the simple things they cannot fix and break other things! It's depressing to spend even a dollar with them.... and now they are effectively threathening that I should spend S$300+ with them or the warranty will be voided?
Re: PML BS again?
thanks louis. just a update on the points i brought up previously from a long time bmw owner:
1. scratch on 2 windows glass
> 2 inch fine micronscratch outside 2 window was confirmed caused by sharp object like penknife, as suspected, the only person who use penknife on my car windows is likely the windows film tinting company. dont think can claim this?
2. noisy carseat
> took a test drive with guru and we found out it turn out to be a false alarm - baby chair at rear is the culprit making the noisy sound.
3. squeaky brakes
> Orh LuLu advise to press brake hard and i tried it and also did ebrake with ABS. after which it seems the brake pad "seasoned" and now no sound liao. still monitoring this.
4. clacky driver door
> apparently now no sound now. suspect it is from outside the car door.
5. airbag sensor stay liteup for 1 minute during startup
> apparently its no a problem according to the bmw owner. sometimes it takes longer to initialize. it added up to about 20 second at most and not 1 minute on startup.
so now left with item 3 to monitor. if still have sound, will bo bian and consult PML.
louis said:
thanks louis. just a update on the points i brought up previously from a long time bmw owner:
1. scratch on 2 windows glass
> 2 inch fine micronscratch outside 2 window was confirmed caused by sharp object like penknife, as suspected, the only person who use penknife on my car windows is likely the windows film tinting company. dont think can claim this?
2. noisy carseat
> took a test drive with guru and we found out it turn out to be a false alarm - baby chair at rear is the culprit making the noisy sound.
3. squeaky brakes
> Orh LuLu advise to press brake hard and i tried it and also did ebrake with ABS. after which it seems the brake pad "seasoned" and now no sound liao. still monitoring this.
4. clacky driver door
> apparently now no sound now. suspect it is from outside the car door.
5. airbag sensor stay liteup for 1 minute during startup
> apparently its no a problem according to the bmw owner. sometimes it takes longer to initialize. it added up to about 20 second at most and not 1 minute on startup.
so now left with item 3 to monitor. if still have sound, will bo bian and consult PML.
