Wish List for F30/80 M3
- Thread starter clar
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Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
N/A V8 with a flat plane crank, revving to 9,000rpm...so basically a 458 engine in a M3 hahah
Weight dropped to 1400kg at least
Both of which will never happen I guess
The steering for me is okay, it's fast and accurate...can't ask too much more from modern sports cars without making it too focused.
N/A V8 with a flat plane crank, revving to 9,000rpm...so basically a 458 engine in a M3 hahah
Weight dropped to 1400kg at least
Both of which will never happen I guess
The steering for me is okay, it's fast and accurate...can't ask too much more from modern sports cars without making it too focused.
Champwhite
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
Proper monobloc brakes...
Proper monobloc brakes...
clar
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
U are not very demanding, aren't u I think there is a good chance the next M3 will get that just like the F10 M5. I am not sure if it would be very good though. BMW always leaves much to be desired when it comes to brakes. Adequate, but not outstanding.
Champwhite;780633 said:
U are not very demanding, aren't u
I think there is a good chance the next M3 will get that just like the F10 M5. I am not sure if it would be very good though. BMW always leaves much to be desired when it comes to brakes. Adequate, but not outstanding.
AC Schnitzer
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
I think what you guys need to remember is the theme of the M3.
It is and always will be an A to B car that seats 4 pax comfortably, luxury, serves supermarket duties with ease, great handling.
As long as you see the words 4 pax, luxury and supermarket duties, weight will not go down. Look at E30 - E9X.
I'm sure the focus will be on handling, the much talk-about powerplant and fuel consumption. Tyre width may increase from the current 245/265 but I'm not placing any bets.
But yes, I do want my flat crank V8, 8300/9000rpm, 1350kilos. Power can remain the same if the latter conditions are met.
I think what you guys need to remember is the theme of the M3.
It is and always will be an A to B car that seats 4 pax comfortably, luxury, serves supermarket duties with ease, great handling.
As long as you see the words 4 pax, luxury and supermarket duties, weight will not go down. Look at E30 - E9X.
I'm sure the focus will be on handling, the much talk-about powerplant and fuel consumption. Tyre width may increase from the current 245/265 but I'm not placing any bets.
But yes, I do want my flat crank V8, 8300/9000rpm, 1350kilos. Power can remain the same if the latter conditions are met.
clar
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
M cars are not benchmarked against prev M model, but against its series model. F10 M5 is one heavy ass car no thanks to the donor F10 platform. M made it very clear that their goal is to reduce weight gain relative to its series model and they are doing better with each model. The F30 is lighter than E90, so it's safe to assume the next M3 will be lighter too.
AC Schnitzer;781702 said:
M cars are not benchmarked against prev M model, but against its series model. F10 M5 is one heavy ass car no thanks to the donor F10 platform. M made it very clear that their goal is to reduce weight gain relative to its series model and they are doing better with each model. The F30 is lighter than E90, so it's safe to assume the next M3 will be lighter too.
Champwhite
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
Haha... I think the current car is enough for a mere mortal like me...
clar;780638 said:U are not very demanding, aren't u
Haha... I think the current car is enough for a mere mortal like me...
AC Schnitzer
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
If you have said, M Cars are developed from its series model, that may have sounded right even though 9x% of the components in a M3 is not alike to its series model. To benchmark against its series model, perhaps not so.
You can't develop a next gen M3 which will easily be quicker than its series model but not be quicker than previous gen M3 otherwise you start going backwards in time. It is not evolution. With every generation of M3, the next gen of M3 has to be quicker in some aspects.
Its interesting that you mentioned the F30. Family just received delivery of a F30 this month and I was just going through the brochure looking at the numbers, in particular, the weight and contrasting those figures with E90.
F30 328 (AT): 1530 Kg
E90 325 (AT): 1535 Kg
Difference: 5Kg
F30 335 (AT): 1595 Kg
E90 335: (AT): 1625 Kg
Difference: 30Kg
The figures are encouraging as BMW managed to stop this weight issue from spiraling upwards but definitely not stellar.
We have to take into consideration that once you put in a LSD, wider rims and tyres at all 4 corners, larger calipers, rotors, EDC, throw in DCT which added another 20Kg compared to 6Spd, strengthening of chassis, control arms etc etc. and weight quickly adds on.
E90 335 (AT): 1625 Kg
E90 M3 (DCT): 1690 Kg
Difference: 65 Kg
65Kg when the S65 weigh in 15-20Kg lighter than S54.
M Tuning Division’s CEO, Ludwig Willisch, 2009
Source: The Future of BMWs M Division: New Turbo Fours and Sixes Likely - Motor Trend Blog
If Power remains the same as E9X M3s, I honestly hope weight savings be more than historical figures.
Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking you with my skepticism but weight doesn't magically disappears as you add more items. You can lighten this and that with Aluminum or Carbon Fibre and what not, which quickly adds up costs and whether stingy people like myself is willing to pay a premium or change my uniform to something with 4 rings or a 3 pointed Star.
As an enthusiast, I have always wanted a lighter car. What the M division did not deliver in weight, they compensated in the lap times department and that is good enough for me.
If Dr. Segler were to follow Willisch's philosophy, I certainly hope the decline in weight would be more significant. We are not likely not see triple digits here.
When I first saw the weight of the E92 M3 I nearly fell off my chair. After owning both E46 and E92 M3 concurrently, driving and tracking it, you'll start to see why and the 1690 or 1680 figure doesn't seem to matter so much anymore.
From my stand point, I don't think I will be disappointed with the next M3. Having driven M3s from E30 to E92 except for E36, so far the people at M have done it right.
Consumer's wants are insatiable. We want our M3s to weigh like GT3s yet not willing to part ways with iDrive, 4 seats and a big boot. That's human nature I guess.
clar;781804 said:
If you have said, M Cars are developed from its series model, that may have sounded right even though 9x% of the components in a M3 is not alike to its series model. To benchmark against its series model, perhaps not so.
You can't develop a next gen M3 which will easily be quicker than its series model but not be quicker than previous gen M3 otherwise you start going backwards in time. It is not evolution. With every generation of M3, the next gen of M3 has to be quicker in some aspects.
Its interesting that you mentioned the F30. Family just received delivery of a F30 this month and I was just going through the brochure looking at the numbers, in particular, the weight and contrasting those figures with E90.
F30 328 (AT): 1530 Kg
E90 325 (AT): 1535 Kg
Difference: 5Kg
F30 335 (AT): 1595 Kg
E90 335: (AT): 1625 Kg
Difference: 30Kg
The figures are encouraging as BMW managed to stop this weight issue from spiraling upwards but definitely not stellar.
We have to take into consideration that once you put in a LSD, wider rims and tyres at all 4 corners, larger calipers, rotors, EDC, throw in DCT which added another 20Kg compared to 6Spd, strengthening of chassis, control arms etc etc. and weight quickly adds on.
E90 335 (AT): 1625 Kg
E90 M3 (DCT): 1690 Kg
Difference: 65 Kg
65Kg when the S65 weigh in 15-20Kg lighter than S54.
M Tuning Division’s CEO, Ludwig Willisch, 2009
Source: The Future of BMWs M Division: New Turbo Fours and Sixes Likely - Motor Trend Blog
If Power remains the same as E9X M3s, I honestly hope weight savings be more than historical figures.
Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking you with my skepticism but weight doesn't magically disappears as you add more items. You can lighten this and that with Aluminum or Carbon Fibre and what not, which quickly adds up costs and whether stingy people like myself is willing to pay a premium or change my uniform to something with 4 rings or a 3 pointed Star.
As an enthusiast, I have always wanted a lighter car. What the M division did not deliver in weight, they compensated in the lap times department and that is good enough for me.
If Dr. Segler were to follow Willisch's philosophy, I certainly hope the decline in weight would be more significant. We are not likely not see triple digits here.
When I first saw the weight of the E92 M3 I nearly fell off my chair. After owning both E46 and E92 M3 concurrently, driving and tracking it, you'll start to see why and the 1690 or 1680 figure doesn't seem to matter so much anymore.
From my stand point, I don't think I will be disappointed with the next M3. Having driven M3s from E30 to E92 except for E36, so far the people at M have done it right.
Consumer's wants are insatiable. We want our M3s to weigh like GT3s yet not willing to part ways with iDrive, 4 seats and a big boot. That's human nature I guess.
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AC Schnitzer
Well-Known Member
Re: Wish List for F30/80 M3
Thanks for correcting me.
So from 2009-2012 from Willisch to Segler to Nitschke.
At least we now know there is more than one person to thank for the next M3.
Oilman;782673 said:
Thanks for correcting me.
So from 2009-2012 from Willisch to Segler to Nitschke.
At least we now know there is more than one person to thank for the next M3.
