Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

chickenbackside;155795 said:
KW3 is indeed the most comfortable coilovers I've ever experienced. But still far away from the comfort of FSDs lah... But handling of KW3 is very very nice...

After reading all these, I still dont know how much better is coilovers over springs for senior citizen bengs like me who doest visit the track. For Koni FSD is VERY comfortable?

Any second hand KW coilovers for sale? :) :cloud9:
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Will b hard to come by used KW for E90 as some are changing to coilover or hv just put the coilover and are enjoying it..
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Ahbengdriver;155843 said:
After reading all these, I still dont know how much better is coilovers over springs for senior citizen bengs like me who doest visit the track. For Koni FSD is VERY comfortable?

Any second hand KW coilovers for sale? :) :cloud9:

Put it this way: FSD's are the most comfortable aftermarket shocks you can buy.

The best thing about them is, while they're comfortable, they IMPROVE the handling of your car at the same time.

If you do not track your car, the reasons why you'd wanna spend so much money on coilovers are:

1) you drive like a mad man on public roads doing swerving manouvres that create a lot of G-force that need heavy damping from your shocks to prevent your car from rolling over

2) you have a strong desire to customise your ride height to the last millimeter

3) you like harsh riding cars

4) when people ask you what suspension you're on, you can say "xxx COILOVERS"

5) you like loud colours like smurf blue, yellow, purple... peeping out from underneath your car

6) coilovers cause some kind of uncontrollable arousal that you cannot derive from anything else
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

If you remember his first post he is only going for looks...................... for what u described, u have miss out one very important equation, strut bars.

chickenbackside;155916 said:
Put it this way: FSD's are the most comfortable aftermarket shocks you can buy.

The best thing about them is, while they're comfortable, they IMPROVE the handling of your car at the same time.

If you do not track your car, the reasons why you'd wanna spend so much money on coilovers are:

1) you drive like a mad man on public roads doing swerving manouvres that create a lot of G-force that need heavy damping from your shocks to prevent your car from rolling over

2) you have a strong desire to customise your ride height to the last millimeter

3) you like harsh riding cars

4) when people ask you what suspension you're on, you can say "xxx COILOVERS"

5) you like loud colours like smurf blue, yellow, purple... peeping out from underneath your car

6) coilovers cause some kind of uncontrollable arousal that you cannot derive from anything else
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Strut bars?? I don't think so....

Swaybars are the stuff to go for in terms of improving handling.

'The Great White'
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Actually not really lah. I was just answering Ah Beng's question:

Ahbengdriver;155843 said:
After reading all these, I still dont know how much better is coilovers over springs for senior citizen bengs like me who doest visit the track. For Koni FSD is VERY comfortable?
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

How long can the coilover last before u need a replacement. Or never need to?
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

wilman2772;155923 said:
Strut bars?? I don't think so....

Swaybars are the stuff to go for in terms of improving handling.

'The Great White'

I agree with Wilson.

No difference when I put in my strut bars. After I took them out, also no difference.

But SWAY BARS, you can definitely feel the difference. You car is much flatter in the corners. People say it doesn't change the ride comfort of your car, but from my experience, it does. The car will ride stiffer, especially during lateral movements.
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

wilman2772;155923 said:
Strut bars?? I don't think so....

Swaybars are the stuff to go for in terms of improving handling.

'The Great White'

Can explain your rational, interested to learn about handling and performance...........
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Ahbengdriver;155925 said:
How long can the coilover last before u need a replacement. Or never need to?

Most reputable coilovers have very good warraties, for eg, PSS9's have LIFETIME warranties. No need to worry about the thing breaking down.
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Definition of SWAY bars work, taken from wikipedia:

Sway bar (also stabilizer bar, anti-sway bar, roll bar, or anti-roll bar, ARB) is an automobile suspension device. It connects opposite (left/right) wheels together through short lever arms linked by a torsion spring. A sway bar increases the suspension's roll stiffness -- its resistance to roll in turns, independent of its spring rate in the vertical direction.

In a turn, the sprung mass of the vehicle's body rotates around its roll axis. The roll axis is a line that joins the front and rear roll centers (SAEJ670e). If the vertical distance between the roll axis and the center of gravity is not zero, a torque (roll moment) equal to the centrifugal force times the distance between the center of gravity and the roll axis will be exerted on the sprung mass, causing the body to lean towards the outside of the turn. This force is called the roll couple. One effect of body (frame) lean, for typical suspension geometry, is positive camber of the wheels on the outside of the turn and negative on the inside, which reduces their cornering grip (especially with radial tires).

Roll couple is resisted by the suspension's roll stiffness, which is a function of the spring rate of the vehicle's springs and of the anti-roll bars, if any. The use of anti-roll bars allows designers to reduce body lean without making the suspension's springs stiffer in the vertical plane, which allows improved body control with less compromise of ride quality.

The spring rate of an anti-roll bar is based on the fourth power of the torsion bar's diameter, the stiffness of the material, the inverse of the length of the lever arms (i.e., the shorter the lever arm, the stiffer the bar), the geometry of the mounting points, and the rigidity of the bar's mounting points. Some anti-roll bars, particularly those intended for use in auto racing, are adjustable, allowing their stiffness to be altered by increasing or reducing the length of the lever arms. This permits the roll stiffness to be tuned for different situations without replacing the entire bar.

Increasing the roll stiffness of the suspension increases the rate of weight (load) transfer to the wheels on the outside of the turn. The load transfer at the other end of the vehicle is equally decreased. As more load is applied to the outer wheels, their slip angles tend to increase, and become unlimited as the limit of adhesion is reached. If the front and rear weight transfer is unequal, the slip angles of the end with the greater weight transfer will tend to be larger, resulting in understeer or oversteer. The use of anti-roll bars allows the weight transfer of the front and rear wheels to be adjusted separately, compensating for other factors such as unequal front/rear weight balance and "tuning" the vehicle's handling characteristics.
Reducing body lean has other benefits such as reducing the sideways of force on the driver, passengers and cargo, allowing the car to respond more quickly to changes in steering and reducing the chance of exceeding the limits of suspension travel.
[edit]Drawbacks

Because an anti-roll bar connects wheels on the opposite sides of the vehicle together, the bar will transmit the force of one-wheel bumps to the opposite wheel. On rough or broken pavement, anti-roll bars can produce jarring, side-to-side body motions (a "waddling" sensation), which increase in severity with the diameter and stiffness of the sway bars.
Some high-priced cars, such as the Mercedes S-class and BMW 7-series, have begun to use "active" anti-roll bars that can be connected or disconnected automatically by a suspension-control computer, reducing body lean in turns while improving rough-road ride quality.
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

chickenbackside;155927 said:
I agree with Wilson.

No difference when I put in my strut bars. After I took them out, also no difference.

But SWAY BARS, you can definitely feel the difference. You car is much flatter in the corners. People say it doesn't change the ride comfort of your car, but from my experience, it does. The car will ride stiffer, especially during lateral movements.

I can feel the difference leh......... sway bars, my car come with front and rear as standard, now a days BMW's got no sway bars meh???
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Definition of STRUT bars from Wikipedia:

A strut bar or strut brace is a mostly aftermarket car suspension accessory used in conjunction with MacPherson struts on monocoque or unibody chassis to provide extra strength between the strut towers.

With a MacPherson strut suspension system where the spring and shock absorber are combined in the one suspension unit, the entire vertical suspension load is transmitted to the top of the vehicle's strut tower, unlike a double wishbone suspension where the spring and shock absorber may share the load separately. In general terms, a strut tower in a monocoque chassis is a reinforced portion of the inner wheel well and is not necessarily directly connected to the main chassis rails. For this reason there is inherent flex within the strut towers relative to the chassis rails.

A strut bar is designed to reduce this strut tower flex by tying two parallel strut towers together. This transmits the load of each strut tower during cornering via tension and compression of the strut bar which shares the load between both towers and reduces chassis flex.

A direct result of this is improved chassis rigidity (similar to that gained from a lower tie bar); hence, the understeer is reduced, tire wear improved and metal fatigue is greatly reduced in the strut tower area. Following the aftermarket's lead, some manufacturers have started fitting strut bars to performance models, including the NISSAN Skyline R34, certain Nissan Sentra models (e.g. Sentra 2.0SE), Acura CL Type-S, and the HOLDEN VY II Commodore, as standard equipment.



An informative link to additional info on strut bars:

http://e30m3performance.com/myths/Strutbar_Theory/strut_bar_theory.htm
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Fantastic bro!!! Thanks for the 'cut & paste'!!

There are so many topics & reviews on swaybars, strut bars, coilovers & yet still got ppl dunno what they are & wat it does..............

Sigh...................


'The Great White'
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

Gombat;155933 said:
I can feel the difference leh......... sway bars, my car come with front and rear as standard, now a days BMW's got no sway bars meh???

Every car also got sway bars, but what we do is install UPRATED sway bars. They are thicker and heavier, adjustable to the stiffness that you want...

Very good handling performance upgrade, unlike strut bars.

Maybe I have an insensitive ass.

With my strut bars, the feeling was "Got difference meh? Car still rolls like a pig when taking corners at high speeds.."

With my sway bars, the feeling was "Hua lan eh!! Car feels like got magnet sucking it down to the road!"

But then, it's all a matter of perception. Speak to people who have coilovers on stiff settings, they will say "sway bars got difference meh?? Waste of time..."
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

My point exactly to answer Gombat's statement:

Gombat;155933 said:
I can feel the difference leh......... sway bars, my car come with front and rear as standard, now a days BMW's got no sway bars meh???

People expect strut bars to flatten their cars during cornering. But from my experience, no such luck...
 
Re: Lowering Spring vs Coilovers?

chickenbackside;155939 said:
My point exactly to answer Gombat's statement:



People expect strut bars to flatten their cars during cornering. But from my experience, no such luck...

I NEVER said that Strut bars will flatten the car during conering, please DO NOT put words in my mouth or be presumtious.
 

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